Simon Cassar has always been immersed in food, working in hospo from a young age and then as an editor atUrban List, where he wrote about Melbourne's dining scene. Now he is the owner of his own pizza shop, Pizza Luna. His journey from writer to pizzaiolo wasn't immediate. He spent time working at DOC in Mornington, running pop-ups in Sorrento, Flinders and over summer at Quealy Wines in Balnarring, and obsessively refining his dough. Inspired by a hybrid pizza style he encountered in New York and London, Simon aims to strike a balance between Neapolitan tradition and the crisp, structured slices of New York. Now, after having honed his craft, he's taking the plunge with a bricks-and-mortar space, where he'll keep things simple: a tight menu, top-quality local ingredients, and a deep commitment to making great pizza.
Hi Simon thanks for your time because I've just realised how busy you are because you're opening a real bricks and mortar shop. That is so exciting. Congratulations. Way to go taking an idea all the way.
Well, I think you just have to have a crack, don't you?
Absolutely. It'd be nice to get the story behind what you're doing. I met you when I went out to Quealy Wines and you were doing your pop-up there and what a good that was, such a great vibe and everyone was just loving it, having the pizzas and the wine and so on.
It was good. Definitely good energy out there.
You worked as an editor for Urban List and so were more on the other side of things. How did you transition from that role into slinging pizzas?
That's an interesting question. I think it's something that just built up time after time of interviewing people. It's probably similar to yourself, when you speak to people who are on this journey and there's so much passion and there's so much excitement, I think I fed off that a little bit and I remember speaking to people. I remember specifically, it was actually a pizza place in Reservoir and I was chatting to them and they were three tradies and they were just done doing tradie work. They said they just got into it, they went straight in with the brick and mortar. I was a little bit more tentative. I loved cooking and I love food and I think the way that the kind of media landscape was, I wasn't getting to do as much of the kind of obsessive food stuff I loved any more. I always wanted to be closer to it and I just wanted to learn more. I've always been weekend cook, even during the week, having friends over, dining out, having ideas, and I wanted to upskill. This was an idea that I really, really wanted to develop. But I think I was scared to take the plunge. Then my wife Isabella said, you just have to go work and in kitchens. I was working as a digital brand manager for a luxury hotel down on the Mornington Peninsula. I would finish work, and I'd go and work at DOC in Mornington. It was a bit of a time. I was doing a lot of hours. But it's one of the things I've realised since doing it is when you're doing it and you want to do it, it's so different. You are so excited it doesn't feel like work. That was writing for a long time. You go to these things, and you get to write about them, and you can't believe you get to do this. You're so into it. But I get very obsessed with things and not always fall out love with them necessarily but always be trying to look towards new things. Cooking new food became the thing. And then I knew what the end goal was because I knew I wanted to open a pizza shop. DOC was obviously incredible. I can't believe I got to do that. I emailed them and went and spoke to them and they were so lovely. I think they could see how passionate I was. It was me in the middle of four Italians, just slinging pizzas through summer, which was very interesting. But it was really good because nothing gets busy like DOC Mornington in summer. There's a lot of pizzas going out.
I would finish work, and I’d go and work at DOC in Mornington. It was a bit of a time. I was doing a lot of hours. But it’s one of the things I’ve realised since doing it is when you’re doing it and you want to do it, it’s so different. You are so excited it doesn’t feel like work. That was writing for a long time. You go to these things, and you get to write about them, and you can’t believe you get to do this. You’re so into it. But I get very obsessed with things and not always fall out love with them necessarily but always be trying to look towards new things. Cooking new food became the thing. And then I knew what the end goal was because I knew I wanted to open a pizza shop. DOC was obviously incredible. I can’t believe I got to do that. ~ Simon Cassar, Pizza Luna
How did you distil from that experience, the kind of pizza that you wanted to make?
That's another good question. I feel like there's a big new movement in pizza. I did a piece for it for Broadsheet last year and it was all about how there's a more hybrid style coming in. You've got traditional Neapolitan pizza, like your DOCs, your Gradis, but then you've got your New York style slices: Sunnyside and Mentone Pizza,Elettricain Thornbury, and then there's this kind of in between thing that's happening. Pizza Elettrica is a little bit in between, but they sometimes do straight New York slices or pizzas. I was influenced from around the world. I did a big three-month honeymoon with my wife. We went to New York and there's two places there. One's called Linda Street in Brooklyn and the other one's called Lucia. They've got a couple of different stores. But eating their pizza, I knew this was it. It was what I wanted to make. I knew that I wanted to make pizza, but I think I was chasing that DOC style and it wasnt really what I liked. DOC is beautiful pizza, but it was funny a lot of the times it would be, not burnt necessarily, but well done is what they call it. Just how I likemy pizza. They would say, we can't do that. The kind of pizza I like is crispy, it's beautifully coloured, a little bit more structure. That was always what I was chasing. It wasn't until I was in New York that I got that from these new places. Then there's a lot of places in London where there's been this movement towards London style pizza: Gracey's, Vincenzo's, Crisp W6, new styles that are an amalgamation of the two schools of thought. It's got the look the Neapolitan and pizza, but it's got the structure of a New York slice. I didn't know that's what I was chasing until I ate it and then ever since it's been what I'm aiming to do. I think every day is different though. Dough is so different. Sometimes it'll be puffier than I would , but you have to roll with the punches.
I was going to ask about that. Is consistency a challenge? Do you keep notes about what might affect the dough? Is it outside temperature? Is it ingredients? What changes the dough?
So much. I'm only scratching the surface. You talk to so many people and they're so pedantic and rightfully so about how their dough program works. For me, because it was a popup, there's so many moving parts that make it so difficult to get the consistency with the dough. It has been made in the prep kitchen, and I was doing private events as well, so I'd be prepping in a food truck. Temperature is definitely the biggest factor, especially doing it through summer in an outdoor service area. There are days where it would be 35 and I'd I wouldn't have time to keep running back and forth to the truck every time to grab dough. I would literally get a dough tray and fill it with ice and then stack the dough on top of that. I had my little portable freezing operation to mitigate the dough over proofing while it was out there. There are definitely days where the temperature has the biggest impact on it. I was just writing down notes all the time. I still have the diary and I'll say what the temperature was, but also what was happening. That was really the biggest one for me, just the logistics of fridge space and temperature. I'm hoping with the shop it's a lot easier. From what I've read from people who have told me in other spaces, summer and hot temperatures just run amok with pizza. Before I started making pizza, I was reading so much and it's so funny how safeguarded making pizza is, and then you go to the reality of it. When I started it was, it needs to be this, it needs to be refrigerated for X amount of time, it has to be brought out of the refrigerator five to six hours before service, or before you want to make it. And then I was working at DOC, it was 35 degrees and you can't have the dough out because it'll prove too hard. So you are literally running, grabbing dough straight out of the fridge and if it's good dough, it'll still stretch. It's definitely not ideal, but it's not as brittle as you think, it can do what you need it to do and you don't have to be so protective of it. That was the biggest challenge definitely with Quealy and pop-ups and private events, getting all those things nailed. Even the temperature, I'd put it in the, in our little moon mobile, the van, and that's a 2001 Toyota Hilux, so the aircon isn't necessarily amazing. Even driving 20 minutes on the peninsula, it's probably 38 degrees in there. I'd noticed a big change as soon as I got to the venue to set up. I'm learning. I'm still so green at this. Every day, every week, making dough, it's a journey. Even people who have been making it for years say that they still haven't perfected it, and things can be different. It's a tough one to wrangle.
In terms of toppings, you had four pizzas, so a less is more approach. Was that a philosophical approach or more of a logistical approach?
I think it's just a laziness. Honestly, it was just the space. I was working out of a food truck with very limited fridge space and it's just me. I would bring in people for service in terms of ordering and running food. But in terms of prep, it was just me. I was really just trying to make my life manageable with the space that we had. You can't have that much set up or that many food ingredients to set up because it just becomes a bit wild. I think the space lends itself to being a bit more casual and a bit more minimalist. But honestly, even opening the shop, I really only want to do eight pizzas and then maybe two rotating specials. Because I just think that and its probably the worst business model, but I just go off things that I love and places I've been to that I think are doing things right. When you've got 25 pizzas on the menu, it's just a bit exhaustive. You've got all that prep and you end up just repeating ingredients and that's not something I really wanted to do. Its nothing like a fine dining thing or anything, oh I can't repeat ingredients, I just wanted to make something that was simple. It's got all the classics, so everything you really need. And if there is demand for more, we'll bring in more, but just to start things off, it's basically because I'm just on this journey and, and learning as I go. I'm really just trying not to bury myself. I want to have control over what I can control and bite off as much as I can chew.
I have to say, as a diner, I much prefer a smaller selection. I'm a foodie and I like to try different things but once I'm faced with choice, I would much rather, there were fewer options. And I really love that you're using local ingredients. And by local do you mean from the peninsula?
As much as I can I use produce from the peninsula. All my wholesalers are down here, and a lot of their stuff is from the peninsula. The honey's a hundred percent. It's the Peninsula Pure Honey. It's definitely something I'm trying to do. Especially working in the journalism editing side of world, that is such a big component. So many places do try and do that, but I did see how it handicapped them a lot of the time. Its the same even with the shop, I want to make sure I have peninsula wine for sure because I live down here plus the wine's incredible, but I don't want to restrict myself and people coming in, because the peninsula classically is chardonnay, pinot noir, the odd pinot gris. Everyone has a different taste. I want to be able to have a selection. So always making sure that the peninsula is top of mind but not being hard and fast about that and just being, oh no, we can't have anything else. Where I can definitely, and I'm just discovering different producers and makers down here.
Just to go back to the toppings. That green pizza with the garlic cream, zucchini, jalapeno basil and pistachio. We had it with stracciatella as well. So delicious. I've never had anything like that. I just thought that flavour combination was so fantastic. Is that your own combination? Or were you inspired by something else? That was excellent.
Oh, thank you so much. I love that pizza. You feel good after it. Its so light and zesty. I can't take all the credit for it at all though, because I was at Quealy one day with a girl working with me, Izzy, and she's vegan and every time that she was working with me previously, didn't have the ingredients for it, she was eating margarita, tomato, garlic, which she was fine with, but I wanted to try and figure out a way we could work on something. I think we usedconfit garlic at the start and then just zucchini and basil. Then I think we talked about bulking it up a bit more, making a bit of a cream or something. I used to make this cashew garlic cream for vegetables, and I thought that might work. It just went on and on. I don't even really know exactly where each component came from, but it wasn't until one day when we were just eating it and then I put stracciatella on and I was, oh my God. What doesn't get better with stracciatella? That's a good question. So yeah, very indebted to Izzy for that one because it forced me to think outside of the box. It's cool because I love that pizza. Other non-vegan people love that pizza as well. I think that's so good because it's so simple just to not have stracciatella with it and then there you go, it's a hundred per cent plant-based, but if you do feel like cheese then it's also a really good pizza. That one is such a keeper for me and I think it's gorgeous looking as well.
Probably one of the funniest things I’ve noticed, having worked in food now is how little I knew. I was never writing reviews. I was covering what was opening and talking about food, not critiquing it, but there was a knowledge gap there even though I was alwayssuper into food. It’s so different as soon as you step to that other side and you learn so much just the most basic stuff. The thing that shocked me the most and shouldn’t be a shock is just how much time goes into prepping andhow hard chefs and people in hospitality work. You tend to forget, but chefing is an insane job. ~ Simon Cassar, Pizza Luna
I'm intrigued that you've reinvented yourself as a producer and how did you approach Quealy and how do people accept you when you are a newcomer to the industry?
That's an interesting one because I worked for a very long time before from when I was 15 to 24 in hospitality flat out, so I had pretty good connections and I moved down here when I was 21 or 22 initially. I've worked with people down here and just honestly been really lucky with opportunities. So a couple of the team I worked at, it's closed now, they've moved to Mount Eliza, but there was a restaurant called Donna Maria in Flinders and now they run Bau Bau in Mount Eliza. They also own Patsy's in the city and Bistro Elba in Sorrento, Clinton, Matt and James. I've known Clinton and worked for Clinton for years and they've all been so lovely to me. They gave me so much knowledge. They let me in the kitchen working under Dan at Donna, which was an amazing experience and then they gave me the space to work out of when they vacated and still had some months left on the lease. It's honestly community stuff and being in the food world and writing about food. I've met so many people and so many people are just willing to help as well. You ask a question, or you put something on Instagram, and people would get back to me or say, congratulations, let me know if you need any help or want to talk or anything. I was just so lucky.There's so many people Matt and Clinton, Ali from Sunnyside Slice, JP from Pizzeria Magma. I went in there and just talked his ear off for two nights. There's honestly so many people so it's a it takes a village type of situation. I think just my past life just opened so many connections. It's not a very big place and everyone knows each other, especially with Instagram, it helps so much because everyone can connect, and people put you onto other people and that's the way that I weaselled myself in. Then a friend of mine was opening a restaurant in Mornington, so I got the opportunity to work under him, at Mr Vincenzos and he's an incredible chef. Hes just an absolute weapon of a chef and he got me to a level that I didn't think I could be at. Then when you go from that to doing pizza, it seems a lot easier because there's so many moving parts in the kitchen and so intense. So when you go from that to making pizzas, it's a very easy transition and it puts it into perspective. Obviously pizza's still very hard, but it got me to a match fitness where I was very comfortable making pizza at a fast rate and being under pressure.
That's great because I think it's as much about that too, isn't it, managing your time and learning how to do that because it's all well and good as you say, cooking for friends at home, but getting up to that level where you are putting them out quickly and then coping with the stress of that, that's a whole other thing.
I'm still paranoid about that. Obviously people have to wait because with the pop up, we had three ovens so it was definitely a very minimal set up. Definitely not ideal for the amount of volume coming through, but everyone was really cool about that I think as well, no one really got bent out of shape that way because it's a beautiful place, you're drinking wine and then the pizza concept is just an added bonus. I think if it was the focus, which the shop will be, that's where we will have to dial it up and smooth the edges and make things a lot more accommodating.
I just realised I didn't answer your question. Quealy came about because Celia, Kathleen Quealy's daughter is the head of marketing for Lucas and I've dined with Celia a few times and she's just a lovely human being. Matt and Clinton have used Quealy wine in their restaurants for so many years, so they knew Kathleen and they said, oh you should go to Quealy for summer. I thought, well I've got two connections here, so let's try and work this out. I messaged Celia, she came and got pizza at Flinders one night for the family. I think she got six or seven pizzas and then the next morning Kathleen came down and we hashed out our plan for the summer and honestly they gave me such a platform. It's such an amazing winery and they helped me out so much. They got a food truck, we got fully set up. They went above and beyond. Normally that back space is completely full of wine making tools, machines and everything. They cleared it out and had tables so that everyone could come in and sit and it was just an incredible place. I owe a lot to them as well, It's just the community. It sounds corny but especially on the peninsula it's even smaller. Everyone's even more connected. Everyone just wants good stuff and they are motivated to give you a hand. New things are exciting and I think people really enjoy giving advice and helping people out down here, which is incredible for people like me.
I love that. It's really great to hear. That's what you want, a community of like-minded people who work together. It's excellent. Just as a final question, what would your current food producing self tell your former food writing self? Or, with the knowledge that you now have on this other side, what, what would you tell your former self?
Probably one of the funniest things I've noticed, having worked in food now is how little I knew. I was never writing reviews. I was covering what was opening and talking about food, not critiquing it, but there was a knowledge gap there even though I was alwayssuper into food. It's so different as soon as you step to that other side and you learn so much just the most basic stuff. The thing that shocked me the most and shouldn't be a shock is just how much time goes into prepping andhow hard chefs and people in hospitality work. You tend to forget, but chefing is an insane job. I wasn't ever a chef, I was a cook. I would just come in and do what I could. I was, I was never at the top tier or anything like that, but you are working 12-hour days, you hardly get a break. And the intensity of it is just so relentless. You are always racing against the clock. I think that was a really interesting thing, in other jobs, going against the clock and some days you look at the clock and its three o'clock, when's five o'clock going to swing by? Whereas when I was in kitchens or working in restaurants, it was, oh my God it is 5.35, I have 20 minutes and I have to be fully set up for and ready for war. It is such a different perspective and not knowing that that's what people do every single day and that the amount of skill and the amount of hard work that goes into it from being a writer, you write about a place, hey they're doing this, this, this and this andit's cool, it's simple, it's fun. But it probably takes pages. That's probably the biggest thing that I would've said to myself.
Simon, thank you so much. All the best for the opening of the store. When do you think you might open?
We're still waiting on the transfer of the liquor license. I think ideally about a month, end of March, early April we will be fully open.
Pizza Luna, McCrae