Josh Niland described the dish Robin Wagner presented at the Pacific Region S. Pellegrino Young Chef competition as, "the best dish" he had tasted this year. Another judge wanted to lick the plate clean. The dish was simply called "Smoked Celeriac with Granny Smith Apple and Crispy Taro," and it won him the Regional Finalist title. And when they say regional, they mean the Pacific region. Next year Robin will fly to Milan to join the finalists from other regions around the world competing for the overall award for 2022-23. Robin started his cooking career in Germany, working in fine-dining Michelin restaurants (Restaurant Vendme and Villa Merton) before moving to Australia and working at Sydneys Sepia and Daylesfords Lake House before calling South Australia home and working as sous chef to Scott Huggins at Penfold's Magill Estate just out of Adelaide. Robin is, of course, honoured to have been chosen for the award, but he also got so much out meeting and being part of the community of chefs the competition creates. I really loved hearing about chefs meeting and connecting and helping each other out and working on food that has a positive impact in the world. You can listen to the podcast here.
Hi Robin, thanks so much for your time today. I imagine you are very busy.
That's ok. It is a little bit busy now, especially with Christmas.
I actually spoke to Scott Huggins the other day, coincidentally before I knew I was going to speak to you, so it is nice to speak to you as well and keep up a Magill Estate theme. Congratulations on being named Best Young Chef for the pacific Region in the S.Pellegrino Young Chef. That's amazing.
It is very lovely.
I'd like to talk a bit about that and then about your background as a chef and your journey so far. I cannot even believe, the photo of your dish looks incredible and it sounds as though there are only three ingredients; smoked celeriac, Granny Smith apple and crispy taro. Tell me how you came up with that. You are not vegan or vegetarian, but it is a vegan dish. Can you tell me a little bit about how you came to that?
I am normally trained with some European influence because I am originally from Germany and I came over to Australia in 2017 with my wife. I have been there for 4 years and Scott pretty much provided me with a blank canvas to try things and develop things and my passion is most of the time for vegan dishes because we always try and give the same experience for everyone, which is not always very easy. We have a very strong vegetarian and vegan menu and we can cater for any kind of dietaries. Most of the time, our dishes come from brainstorming and this one came up as we did that. It was a very long process to get it to the point it was and still have all the notes written down. It probably took three to four months and that was before the pandemic. At that time it was spring as well and we had it on the menu as a cleanser between fish and meat dishes, to cleanse your palate and get you ready for the next chapter. Our menu is always very structured in terms of having the snacks at the beginning, which is already a whole journey and then most of the time we continue with two fish courses and two meat courses. and then it depends on how we go with the fifth course in the centre and this time it was the celeriac dish.
So, the celeriac is smoked, what does that look like and what else do you do in this dish?
It's not the root itself that is smoked, it is the process, how it is prepared. We cook a normal celeriac pure, taking the husk off and then the root gets toasted and roasted, so it is quite dark and has an earthy flavour. Once it is roasted it gets dried for 24 hours and dehydrated and then gets blitzed to a powder. Then we use the root itself and cook it in soy milk until tender and then prepare it like a normal pure but we finish it off with a smoked oil. We smoke grapeseed oil for about five hours and then we emulsify it like a mayonnaise, but vegan. That is where you gain the deep smokiness. This is where it gets a little bit hard, depending on the root, it can be stronger. It depends on how the season has been and on the weather. We are having heavy rain in SA so the flavours and the terroir are always different. We have the crispy taro, which is a normal taro which gets sliced on the meat slicer quite thinly and then deep fried until crispy. We also have a braised celeriac, which is the root thinly sliced on the meat slicer. Then we have two different kinds of reduction; a Granny Smith apple reduction and a celeriac apple reduction. This whole dish is based on the acidity and sweetness from the actual ingredients and there is no added sugar. My intention with this dish to be not only vegan, dairy free and gluten free, but I also did not want to add any kind of sugar that you can buy, no honey, it is just the pure acidity and pure sugar from the vegetables themselves. It sounds quite complicated but it looks simple on the plate; complex simplicity.
Absolutely. I read that Josh Niland, one of the judges, said that it was the best dish he has had all year. That must feel pretty good.
I had not thought that I would make it that far. It was already an honour to be part of it and competing and all the connections that San Pellegrino provided and having this kind of thing was just bloody amazing. I had so many thoughts about this dish and how it would turn out and then having that statement from Josh Niland was just incredible. It made my day. I think it was even more rewarding than the trophy itself.
I can understand that. Have you done other competitions in the past?
Just one randomly in 2018 with Savour pastry. It was more about figuring out where I am at. I have a little bit of background from Europe but I wasn't trained in all the classic tarts and eclairs and so on. It was just to see how I would go. It was alright, it was just nice to see all the other competitors and to have connections in this community.
When I read about the S.Pellegrino competition, it really felt as though they were fostering community and I liked the idea that they have an alumni so once you get past a certain age, and you are no longer a young chef, but you are still part of it. I like the idea of hospitality as a community of like-minded people sharing ideas and encouraging one another.
That is pretty much what it was like. It was not like competing and having pressure and avoiding speaking to one another. It was like a big briefing, just talking to one another and trying to figure out and understand each other and where the ideas come from and how they are expressed. We had quite a few chefs there who had to improvise because the market did not provide everything on point. Mother Nature can sometimes be a little tricky, especially with regards to fish and we just helped each other and went shopping together and tried to find a solution. It was quite nice. I didnt have the feeling it was a competition, it was more like a community. It was really great having such a big supporter, like Scott always there looking after me and giving me advice. It was just incredible.
It sounds like such a great thing to be part of. How are you feeing about the next step? Milan next year, but which part of next year?
I think September or October but we don't have any dates yet. I think there are still some regional finals in other countries in progress. I think Spain or Portugal is next. I saw one of the German chefs who won and I texted him straightaway and said that we would see each other in Milan and he replied that he was looking forward to it and I have never met this person before. It is fantastic.
Do you have to keep practising that dish until then?
Let's see how it goes, yeah. I think the main idea is to stick to the dish. I'm not sure whether I might change the proportions. It was unfortunate that I didn't have the right flowers for this one because the weather has been very bad. It would have been a different garnish. It also depends if I can get that in Italy as well. I am happy I am playing it a little bit safe with flying vegetables over or trying to get what I need over there because some of the dishes with protein chefs will want to make might be a little trickier.
I think it is always a thing when you talk to someone who is not in the same occupation, they always ask how you are able to do all this, work so many hours, and you don’t earn much money. In Europe it is that way, you don’t get great pay compared to Australia but the other reward you are getting is experience which is something no one can take from you and I think that is a really good point. My head chef at the time was a person who taught me how to create a dish. If it was an ingredient from the season, he would build a mind map around it, so if it was a peach, he would be thinking, can we use the bark from the tree as well, can we preserve the leaves, in what kind of terroir is the peach growing? Then he built everything around it and ends up with this dish which is like contemporary art. ~ Robin Wagner
I am interested to know where it all started for you. You are from Germany, but did you always know you wanted to be a chef?
I think so. It is now 15 years since I started. I started when I was 15 and I am turning 30 next year. Cookery was not always a big part of my life, but it was a part. My family are not hospitality or cookery related. They are in a totally different industry. My mum worked a lot and so I had to provide my own food and my grandmother looked after me, but I always knew what I wanted to cook and my grandma was just watching. She just told me this story a few weeks ago when we had a chat. She said, oh yes, it was always like this, you provided the food and I couldn't teach you anything, you knew it all already. At school we ad cookery classes but none of the males went because it was a woman thing. I didn't care. I went to those classes because it was cookery and the others went to the technical ones to do with electricity and stuff.
Then I started my apprenticeship in Frankfurt which had one Michelin star and then two years after we got a second. We were the first regional restaurant in Germany to get a second star. It was an underrated restaurant if we were to compare to NOMA, Rene Redzepi was a big deal and Copenhagen was happening about the same time and my former boss had the same approach in Frankfurt. He gave us a radius around the restaurant of 150km to provide ingredients. We went foraging a lot and preserved ingredients to continue during winter when it is hard to harvest vegetables. This kind of thinking to preserve was incredible. I had the pleasure to continue in Cologne which was a three Michelin star restaurant where I stayed at least three years and it was quite a tough time but amazing to work so many hours at a place like that because the knowledge I got over that period, no one can take that away from me.
I think it is always a thing when you talk to someone who is not in the same occupation, they always ask how you are able to do all this, work so many hours, and you don't earn much money. In Europe it is that way, you don't get great pay compared to Australia but the other reward you are getting is experience which is something no one can take from you and I think that is a really good point. My head chef at the time was a person who taught me how to create a dish. If it was an ingredient from the season, he would build a mind map around it, so if it was a peach, he would be thinking, can we use the bark from the tree as well, can we preserve the leaves, in what kind of terroir is the peach growing? Then he built everything around it and ends up with this dish which is like contemporary art. I started in 2014 there and we were ranked 10th on the worlds best and the next year we were ranked 12thand then we got dumped for different reasons. The experience was amazing. And then I ended up in Australia.
Ok right. Was it a culture shock coming here in terms of food, or other?
We were thinking of either England or Australia. I had a trial and it was a nightmare for me in terms of language. Then we had a working holiday here in 2017 and we really liked it and I had no issues with the Australian accent so it turned out very well for me. I appreciated that Australians take much more care and enjoy food much more when it comes to breakfast. That is something we celebrate as well but you guys just go hard each day having coffee and a nice breakfast in the morning and then having a late lunch and really enjoying it. In Germany we enjoy it with our family but not going out so much. Food culture in Australia is probably a little bit behind in terms of food culture but you guys appreciate it a lot more, which I really like. I love going out for coffee here and I ama always disappointed when I go back to Germany because the coffee culture is just so crap there. I really appreciate the approach in Australia, If you have the passion and really step up, you can definitely make it in Australia. I think you guys are more open to change and you appreciate it and spend the money. It is nice to be here.
I'm glad. And apart from your winning dish, do you have a favourite ingredient you are enjoying using at the moment?
That's a little difficult. I love John Dory as a fish. I miss the fish market in Sydney and fish was a big thing when I was there and in SA, in regards to seafood, it is a little bit weak. We just put queen scallops on the menu and they are amazing. And now we are starting to work on the summer menu which will kick in next week, so I am looking forward to working with whiting again. That is something really South Australian and it's a product we can be proud of.
And just a final question, what would your advice be to people who are considering becoming chefs?
You should be open for any advice, whether it is bad or good, it is about the perspective with which you take it. There is always a point of view you might agree or disagree. What I want to say, is that from the point of view of a long career, you are never going to have only one mentor, because as a chef, you travel everywhere and you try to get as much as much knowledge and experience as possible so you will have someone who teaches you something and then there will be someone who tries to teach you something and you don't agree with it but it is best to take it and agree, but then you do your own thing after a decade or if you open your own business and it is good if you have taken in different perspectives.
78 Penfold Road, Magill, SA